teach me about lipsticks

timhulio · Post by **timhulio** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:45 am

If you can hear the difference between the same pickup mounted in guitars with 25 and 25 1/2 inch scale then you have magic ears and I salute you.

ekwatts · Post by **ekwatts** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 1:43 pm

What the fuck do PRS know? Those things are glorified tables.

I guess it's about being able to hear the mojo.

George · Post by **George** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 2:21 pm

sunshiner wrote:
timhulio wrote:
sunshiner wrote: Danelectro's have shorter scale and lipsticks installed in them should have more meatier sound with rich midrange, the same lipsticks in 25.5 guitar will sound thinner, more stratish, but thicker than usual singles.
No. Danelectro Scale length is 25", whereas a Strat is 25 1/2". Any difference in sound when these pickups are mounted in Strats or Danos has nothing to do with scale length because 25" sounds no different from 25 1/2".
Half of the inch actually is the big difference IMO, 25" is even closer to 24.75" than to 25.5". It's considered by PRS some builders to have advantages of both.

are you serious right now

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 3:44 pm

no real audible sound difference from those scale lengths only real difference is going to be the tension of strings. the only thing that's going to really factor in to the sound of the guitar is the construction, type of pickups, value of the electronics in it, and the amp you're running it through. the amp you're using, plus any pedals, are gonna do most of the work for you, obviously different pickups and guitar styles are gonna tweak the sound going into the pedals and amp.

things like wood(in most cases), scale length, switch tip color, tuners, blah blah blah aren't going to affect your tone.

my telecaster and my jaguar sound almost the same, 5 mins with EQ on an amp you wouldn't be able to tell a difference. jag is 24" tele is 25.5. even if you don't tweak the amp it'll still sound almost the same. solid body, single coils, bolt on neck. you might just be able to notice a difference in sustain since the tele's a string through, but otherwise a guitars a guitar.

even my silvertone with the lipstick pickups sounds really close to the neck pickup on my jazzmaster or tele.

that was a stupid run on post but you get it, scale length isn't gonna make the guitar sound much different, its just gonna make it feel different.

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 3:46 pm

i dont give a shit if a 12lbs les paul or prs sounds like the greatest thing on earth. i'll take a guitar that weighs and costs a quarter of that and sounds close anyday.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 3:55 pm

Josh wrote:only got one lipstick in the neck position of my silvertone. one of the OG lipsticks too.

real clear, bassy, i'd imagine one in the bridge position would brighten it up a lil, would really like to blend two of them too. also hear with a treble booster you can really get the most of a 1448 since it's all clear and bassy, that extra treble makes for some nice fuzzy OD tones. lipsticks also dont take feedback well if you're into that.

yeah, my memory of the pickup in my 1448 was that it was loud and pretty beefy sounding. i wouldn't say it was weak at all.

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 4:08 pm

yeah, and through an old silvertone amp it retains it's cleanness pretty much all the way up, any other guitar breaks it up around halfway. but it's a loud clear pickup. i'd love to see someone totally modd a fucked up 1448 for a bridge pickup and see how that sounds.

sunshiner · Post by **sunshiner** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:15 pm

I don't insist guys, it's just my opinion. Also I said nothing about wood and superior qualities of PRS and Les Paul. Surely you can tune any settings on your amp to make similar sound for two guitars, the question will they sound the same with same settings on amp. Did you think why electric mandolin, tenor guitar and full scale guitar sound different? Because of the scale length, imo. The same effect with the electric guitars of different scales. We all can do such an experiment, plug your guitar in amp choose for example bridge pickup and clean settings on your amp, strum the chord G. Then tune down your guitar for a semitone, put the capo on the first fret and strum again the chord G. Do they sound the same after shortening the scale for about an inch? Now add some gain and play your favorite licks, then take out the capo and tune the guitar to the standard tuning and play all the licks again. Do they sound the same? According to my ears they sound slightly different. So I believe that Tele with humbuckers sounds nothing like Les Paul not because of the set or bolt on neck or mahogany or maple neck or any other factor, but because of the difference in scale length.

George · Post by **George** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:18 pm

sunshiner wrote:I don't insist guys, it's just my opinion. Also I said nothing about and superior qualities of PRS and Les Paul. Surely you can tune any settings on your amp to make similar sound for two guitars, the question will they sound the same with same settings on amp. Did you think why electric mandolin, tenor guitar and full scale guitar sound different? Because of the scale length, imo. The same effect with the electric guitars of different scales. We all can do such an experiment, plug your guitar in amp choose for example bridge pickup and clean settings on your amp, strum the chord G. Then tune down your guitar for a semitone, put the capo on the first fret and strum again the chord G. Do they sound the same after shortening the scale for about an inch? Now add some gain and play your favorite licks, then take out the capo and tune the guitar to the standard tuning and play all the licks again. Do they sound the same? According to my ears they sound slightly different. So I believe that Tele with humbuckers sound nothing like Les Paul not because of the set or bolt on neck or mahogany or maple neck or any other factor, but because of the difference in scale length.

that's because the pickup voicing (position in this case) has changed lol

sunshiner · Post by **sunshiner** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:28 pm

Do it with the acoustic, the sound hole is big enough to omit the changing of voicing for an inch

George · Post by **George** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:47 pm

well no, because the soundhole of an acoustic guitar is basically the pickup and very susceptible to timbre in exactly the same way. and also where you're picking dramatically affects this. if i pick right over the sound hole or neck pickup playing around the 12th fret you bet its gonna sound bassy because im plucking right on the centre of the elliptical plane of the string, and the soundhole/pickup is sympathetic to that because its right above those frequencies. in the same way if i play open notes, but plucking on top of the 12th fret, it will sound similar because again, centre of the elliptical plane.

do me a favour and play your electric guitar, unplugged, picking right as very close to the bridge as possible, and listen to any significant changes as you go up the neck. there aren't any.

what you're observing in your own experiment is that the guitar's voice (timbre) changes due to the relative pickup position changing, and you striking nearer to the centre of the string's elliptical plane because your hand is not right up to the bridge. i don't dispute that it changes, but the guitar's scale is not the driver at all

sunshiner · Post by **sunshiner** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:03 pm

Picking at the different places of the string is just playing with the harmonics of the certain scale imo. I don't know how to say it better, but you have 25.5 and you can play all along the string and have different effects, but it is nothing to do with the lenght of the scale - the string still has the same lenght despite the fact where you picking it.

I think that short scale bass sounds nothing like long scale even if you put the same pickups in the right spots to compensate the difference in scales, barritone with its 27" sounds nothing like 25.5" guitar even if you put exact pickups at the right places. I believe that the same effect, but lesser, we have with different guitar scales like 24, 24.75, 25, 25.5 and that this effect along with the type of the pickup and construction of the bridge brings the character to the sound of the certain guitar. I don't believe in the role of wood in the sound of electric guitar equiped with magnetic pickups