this has been 'bothering' me for quite some time

kim · Post by **kim** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:00 pm

EHX US Big Muffs, love what they do, on guitar ?nd bass...but..

i always notice i lose a lot of punch and definition when i use it on bass, not such a big problem when it's only bass, but as soon as distorted guitars kick in bass is totally lost in the mix, it's annoying... i combine it with a more subtle overdrive pedal too but it doesn't make a big difference..besides it's not efficient having to stomp twice all the time either..
i know this has been mentioned tons and tons before, lots of people modding their BM or trying to find a deluxe BM which has a 'blend' option

but i was thinking... i don't really want to mod the BM.. is there some kind of pedal that lets you blend your clean signal with your effected signal ??
something that would give you two separate sounds (clean/with effects)through the same amp would be cool...
or just a pedal that mixes your effected signal with your clean signal..

getting two rigs to have your clean signal on all the time'd be a bit absurd.. heh

suggestions ?

Pens · Post by **Pens** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:02 pm

I am only aware of such a thing in the DIY world, called the Splitter-Blend. Very popular build for bass. But I do not know of any commercial effect that does the same thing. Sry.

ultratwin · Post by **ultratwin** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:32 pm

Sorry to steer from an accessable solution, but aren't the Russian Muffs known for having better/clearer subs retention in a full mix?

I have to really toy with my Zvex Wooly Mammoth to make sure it's badass in the mix while not blowing up the house system, due to huge subs on top of the buzz when the EQ knob is set below 12:00. It's a monster not easily tamed, and just as hard to judge until everyone's playing at full volume.

And while we're on the subject of bass grind, I so want to try this:

Adjustable mids and a blend knob(!) should keep things very exciting.

Pens · Post by **Pens** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:45 pm

That looks bad ass. 3 band EQ with a mid shift plus blend. Awesome.

kim · Post by **kim** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:57 pm

russian muffs..yeah.. heard about that too.. honestly i've never been able to try one, i did read things about the old 'green/grey' ones either sounding like utter crap or like pure genius, depending on your luck or something... but as i said..never been able to try one, or even find one..heh.. the new ones are pretty cheap... but it's still pretty limited and not very different from the US versions... heard the biggest difference in sound between the US ones and Russian ones is that the US ones can sound more evil/over the top or something..

that mxr blowtorch does look interesting but i found some soundsamples (don't remember where) but i do remember i didn't really like the sound, same thing with the Proco juggernaut, T.Rex bass juice etc... not that they sound bad to me.. but they're all pretty limited in their sound, so is the US muff but i absolutely love it..just too bad it doesn't have more tone controls indeed.

i'm considering either one of those sansamp bass drivers, not sure yet which one, still need to do more research, and/or a fulltone bass drive,
both those pedals have more tone options..i like the idea of the programmable sansamp bass driver, so you can program three different sounds and it can go from light overdrive to an 'almost' distorted sound...
but i'm keeping the BM for sure.. because i just love its sound
i've seen people combining either a sansamp or fulltone with the BM to get more definition tho... but as i said... double stompppp !

maybe i should look around for people building custom pedals that would do what i mentioned above...

Pens · Post by **Pens** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:02 pm

Find a friend with some ability to do electronics to make you a Splitter-Blend. The schematic is online. It will solve your problem.

Post by **Doog** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:16 pm

I know whatcha mean, the bassist in WK uses a NYC Muff and it does kinda lose some "weight" when it's kicked on.

Best solution we found was to keep tone way low- it does actually contour the EQ (rather than being just glorified treble control like on some pedals), and having it too high kills of some low end rumble. We also keep the gain level pretty low too as it tends to make things very messy on anything a bit fast.

The bassist from Ben Folds 5 used a Sovtek Big Muff (not sure what version), and it never sounded too empty when used on live recordings. Although I suppose there's no guitars to compete with..

heavium wrote:i've seen people combining either a sansamp or fulltone with the BM to get more definition tho... but as i said... double stompppp !

You could build a bypass loop, leave the pedals switched on, and just use the loopers own footswitch to change between "clean" and "fuzz". I built one a few months back and it's pretty simple. Not a good choice for battery users though, obviously.

I can't see a simple blend loop being too hard circuit to wire up, either.

And Wooly Mammoths sound soooo good. Appauled at the pricetag though.

euan · Post by **euan** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:22 pm

Woolly Mamoth is a pedal I'd love cos it's so low down dirty. But I can't justify it. Ever.

I need to start messing about with the caps in my BMP clone before I mount it. I might do that this weekend actually.

kim · Post by **kim** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:27 pm

i already mentioned this thing to one of our guitarists and he did say he could probably help out with this thing but i don't think he's very experiened with building pedals, he does know a lot about electronica, but doesn't have all the parts either ..with some research it must be possible to find out what you need for that..hm...

doog, tone all the way down yes, that's what i do when i use the BM on bass too, volume depends of course and the sustain's never past 11 o'clock.

zvex make some fucking amazing pedals, i love that ringtone pedal

the mammoth is very extreme, not just the sound but also its price (for me anyway..wouldn't like to take that one everywhere.)

edit: i've no soldering iron and shit like that, the only tool-ish stuff i do have lying around are screwdrivers..haha, so i'm not able to make even the simplest stomp box, i'd spend more money on getting all the tools for making one than letting someone with more experience build it for me

Gandalf · Post by **Gandalf** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:30 pm

haha theres a thread like this on the dino board as well. only its about boosting the big muff.

Pens · Post by **Pens** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:06 pm

Well euan hinted at this but the other thing to try is changing the caps in the input and output of your BM to larger values. This will allow more bass frequencies through and you shouldn't lose as much oompf.

kim · Post by **kim** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:25 pm

i read about that mod at the talkbass forum, but it's not worth modding it ..to me anyway, i use the same one for guitar so i don't want to mod it .. it's not really that i'm missing low end with the BM either, i'm just missing the direct-ness of a clean signal, little details get lost in the mix when there's two guitars with heavy distortion playing too... so i still think the solution lies in a 'blend' knob for the clean/effected signal so i can mix a clean, bell-like precision bass sound (plectrum) with a distorted/fuzzed BM sound..best of both worlds at once

Pens · Post by **Pens** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:31 pm

I do agree, I just wanted to suggest that as an easier alternative to a whole new box. IF you find someone to make one, the schem and article is here. I would offer to make one for you BUT being in the US the shipping would be retarded high and it would likely be easier to just have it made there. Plus the lack of time I have right now. Sound clips on that link as well. Let us know how it goes!

kim · Post by **kim** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:44 pm

thanks for the link penpen ! shipping costs are insane indeed, there's a guy at the dutch bass forum i post at who makes custom pedals so i could prolly ask him

edit: came across this page, scroll all the way down to the last stompbox (xotic blend) it's kind of what i need...no; it's exactly what i need.

http://analogman.com/xblend.htm