N00b needs help with shielding

Noirie. · Post by **Noirie.** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:45 am

Hi there guys

Okay, My CIJ Jaguar picks up any noise, hum, whatever. I've looked under the metal plates and theres no shielding just crumply black stuff(eck).

I've tried shielding it like with carboard wrapped in tin foil in a homemade attempt at shielding plates. Hasn't worked.

The only way to cut out the noise is by touching the metal plates.

Help!

Ty · Post by Ty » Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:40 am

Could possibly be a grounding issue, had a similar problem on my mustang after re-wiring it the first time. Fixed it by re-grounding it to the control plate (I think, it's been awhile since I did this) and haven't a problem since.

Bacchus · Post by **Bacchus** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 4:51 am

I think that if it's going away when you touch a metal part, then it's likely a grounding issue.

othomas2 · Post by **othomas2** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:16 am

I think its the other way ?? when there's still a buzz when touching the strings there's a prob no ??

I lined the back of my CIJ jag plate with foil and it worked a treat.... but I had a quarter pounder in the bridge and then a jb.

My advice would be to not sit on your laptop.

Joey · Post by **Joey** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:19 pm

If the guitar body cavities are black, they are painted with a conductive paint (shield).

If you touch a metal part of the guitar and it gets quiet, then the guitar is working correctly. If you touch the strings, bridge, tuners, metal control plates... etc and there is no noise reduction, then you have a problem.

Don't shove cardboard in the guitar, you'll only cause more problems by shorting something out. Get some copper foil adhesive tape from StewMac. If you can't afford that, get ducting tape (aluminum foil tape)... not duct tape that you fix your car radiator with. You don't have to do the guitar cavities if they are already painted... but if you want to, go ahead and knock yourself out (I do). I'd definitely would pull all the hardware/electronics off the pickguard and sheild it with foil tape. I fold about a 1/4" of tape over on the edge. Scuff the tape up lightly where the tapes overlap, for better continuity... the folded edge also helps continuity. You can try solder a small bead at each overlap for better continuity also, but it's harder on aluminum foil tape... copper is easier to solder. Check the shield with a continuity tester. You shouldn't have to ground the pickguard on most guitars, cause the switches & pots are already grounded to the body shield & bridge.

Reece · Post by **Reece** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 6:24 pm

Make sure that the little wire in the trem cavity that's supposed to touch the plate hasn't come loose.

I had buzzing problems for ages until Doog mentioned that little wire and I moved it back into place.

Noirie. · Post by **Noirie.** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 7:16 pm

Cheers guys. I'll have another look at it tomorrow and take the homemaded shielding attempt.

Again thanks! =D

Markn951 · Post by **Markn951** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:01 pm

Joey wrote:
If you touch a metal part of the guitar and it gets quiet, then the guitar is working correctly.

So, is there any way to make it quiet all the time? I guess my guitar is working correctly but I HATE that buzz! True, it goes away when I touch the strings or bridge but it's still annoying as hell!

James · Post by **James** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:25 pm

You could use a noise gate. If you get a good one it won't change your sound at all. All it will do is mute your signal when it goes between a certain level. You can set attack and decay settings so it doesnt die off unnaturally. You'll find that you can let notes ring out and the last bit may sound slightly different but not noticeably so. With the threshold set to mute the signal when there is no signal over than the hum, you wouldn't be able to tell it was turned on other than the lack of unwanted noise.

If possible, go for a rackmount one. As with compressors pedal versions are generally a bit rubbish and inflexible. You don't have to go for an expensive rackmount one (I imagine you can easily spend over a grand on a gate) because the purpose you're using it for isn't going to make the most of the added functionality and audio quality of pricey model. Just think what you'd spend on a pedal version and aim to spend that on a rackmount piece, even if a small half rack thing. Stick it on top of your amp and plug your pedalboard or whatever into that as the last item in the chain. It would make more sense to have it early in the signal chain as any distortion pedals are similar are going to negate some of the effectiveness but it'd be more convenient there.

Of course you could get a pedal version. It'd probably serve you well enough and would be easier to have at the front of your signal chain which is where you'd probably want it for the purpose you describe.

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:29 pm

Markn951 wrote:
Joey wrote:
If you touch a metal part of the guitar and it gets quiet, then the guitar is working correctly.
So, is there any way to make it quiet all the time? I guess my guitar is working correctly but I HATE that buzz! True, it goes away when I touch the strings or bridge but it's still annoying as hell!

HUMBUCKERS.

James · Post by **James** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:32 pm

That stuff about rackmount you can probably ignore. I sincerely believe that rackmount compressors and gates offer much better value than pedal versions, but you'll be fine with a pedal in this application.

Joey · Post by **Joey** » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:36 pm

Markn951 wrote:
Joey wrote:
If you touch a metal part of the guitar and it gets quiet, then the guitar is working correctly.
So, is there any way to make it quiet all the time? I guess my guitar is working correctly but I HATE that buzz! True, it goes away when I touch the strings or bridge but it's still annoying as hell!

Sheilding helps. Shield size does matter also.

My guitar with active EMG pickups is dead quiet and I removed the ground wire that connects to the bridge, as the instructions said to... but that's totally different from what you guys with passive pickups.

I'm an electrician, I should know the answer to this stuff... but I honestly don't. When you touch the strings, you become the ground. The cable from your amp to the guitar, has two wires in it. The receptacle outlet you plug your amp into has 3 wires... hot - nuetral - ground. Hot sends power to the amp. Nuetral returns it. Ground is a safety wire, if a short should develop it sends voltage back to the panel ---> to the meter on the outside of the house ---> down a thick gauge wire and into two 8' ground rods driven into the dirt.

Only thing I could think is to check your electrical outlet and make sure it's ground propertly. A cheap plug in tester will confrim it. I'd suppose an ungrounded outlet may be a bit noisier then a grounded outlet.... but fuck, most houses don't have ground wires... that didn't come along until the late 1960's and it was just a thin 16 or 18 AWG. Wasn't until the 70's did code mandate the ground be the same size as the other two conductors (mostly 12 or 14 AWG).

I propose a 3 wire guitar/cable with an isolated ground that uses the household ground... cept if your house gets hit by lightning, it will fill follow the easiest path to ground... you holding the guitar. Fuck I dunno, ask mike or someone else

Bacchus · Post by **Bacchus** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 2:26 am

Joey wrote:I propose a 3 wire guitar/cable with an isolated ground that uses the household ground... cept if your house gets hit by lightning, it will fill follow the easiest path to ground... you holding the guitar. Fuck I dunno, ask mike or someone else

You just need to build a copper guitar room to play in, and paint the walls and floor with rubber. A simple and inelegant solution, I'll admit, but a solution none the less.

prospect · Post by **prospect** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:17 am

Hey man.

It sounds like you need more than just shielding.
However I actually have a spare CIJ shield plate that I don't need.

Cover shipping ($4?) and it's yours.

Noirie. · Post by **Noirie.** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:21 am

Sure. Pm'd.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:33 am

James wrote:You could use a noise gate. If you get a good one it won't change your sound at all. All it will do is mute your signal when it goes between a certain level. You can set attack and decay settings so it doesnt die off unnaturally. You'll find that you can let notes ring out and the last bit may sound slightly different but not noticeably so. With the threshold set to mute the signal when there is no signal over than the hum, you wouldn't be able to tell it was turned on other than the lack of unwanted noise.

If possible, go for a rackmount one. As with compressors pedal versions are generally a bit rubbish and inflexible. You don't have to go for an expensive rackmount one (I imagine you can easily spend over a grand on a gate) because the purpose you're using it for isn't going to make the most of the added functionality and audio quality of pricey model. Just think what you'd spend on a pedal version and aim to spend that on a rackmount piece, even if a small half rack thing. Stick it on top of your amp and plug your pedalboard or whatever into that as the last item in the chain. It would make more sense to have it early in the signal chain as any distortion pedals are similar are going to negate some of the effectiveness but it'd be more convenient there.

Of course you could get a pedal version. It'd probably serve you well enough and would be easier to have at the front of your signal chain which is where you'd probably want it for the purpose you describe.

that EHX thing that duosonicboy has seemed ok for what it did. might be worth a look.