Re-Tubing Sovtek Mig-60

endsjustifymeans · Post by **endsjustifymeans** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:55 pm

So I'm thinking of using the same tubes as this guys did:

http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:Ph ... ent=safari

My question is... How do I find out which one is the V1, V2 and phase inverter, I looked at the schematic and then realized I that I had no idea how to read that shit.

http://www.schematicheaven.com/newamps/sovtek_mig60.pdf

Apparently this setup offer a bit more clean headroom, which I could use.

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:06 pm

V1 is just the first preamp tube - usually the closest one to the input jack the next one is v2 and so on. the phase inverter is usually the one closest to the power tubes.

euan · Post by **euan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:07 pm

what sloan said

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:08 pm

also, of note is that 12ax7's are 'dual triode' tubes. that means they are actually two triode type tubes in one housing. so when you look at a schematic and see that first tube thing you might see 'V1a' which is the first triode of the first 12ax7, 'V1b' would be the second half. it is confusing at first. they are not always next to each other and can even be in different channels.

endsjustifymeans · Post by **endsjustifymeans** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:08 pm

That makes it super easy. Thanks brah.

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:11 pm

hey,
also, before you spend a shit on some 'mullard' tube, look up information on the real manufacturer. as far as i know the new 'mullard' tube are just different sovteks. Groove Tubes, some EHX stuff is all sovtek, Ruby is chinese. JJ/Tesla is always their own thing.

preamp tubes usually have more effect on your overall 'tone' than powertubes will. i found jj's to be too muddy in my ampeg and cheap ass sovtek's took care of the problem and it sounds great. i suggest getting some jj's and some sovteks and mixing and matching to your liking. you may like a jj in v1, sovtek as the phase inverter etc... mix and match to find what works for you.

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:13 pm

all that shit about 'balanced' tubes. fuck it, you don't need that bullshit. your playing a goddamn guitar though a guitar amp that's running through a guitar-voiced speaker. there is no need for all this bullshit. all the hype is for audiophile fucktards that think it's worth paying a little more for a slight audio advantage when they listen to ASIA though altecs and shit.

endsjustifymeans · Post by **endsjustifymeans** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:14 pm

Sloan wrote:hey,
also, before you spend a shit on some 'mullard' tube, look up information on the real manufacturer. as far as i know the new 'mullard' tube are just different sovteks. Groove Tubes, some EHX stuff is all sovtek, Ruby is chinese. JJ/Tesla is always their own thing.

preamp tubes usually have more effect on your overall 'tone' than powertubes will. i found jj's to be too muddy in my ampeg and cheap ass sovtek's took care of the problem and it sounds great. i suggest getting some jj's and some sovteks and mixing and matching to your liking. you may like a jj in v1, sovtek as the phase inverter etc... mix and match to find what works for you.

Rad, that'd definitely be cheaper. It's still got the original tubes from the 90's in there and they're definitely showing their age. Plus I've heard of alot of people gaining significant clean headroom with the right tube combo.

euan · Post by **euan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:17 pm

balanced tubes in power section for sure.

Difference positioning of different tubes make in preamp

endsjustifymeans · Post by **endsjustifymeans** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:18 pm

Sloan wrote:hey,
also, before you spend a shit on some 'mullard' tube, look up information on the real manufacturer. as far as i know the new 'mullard' tube are just different sovteks. Groove Tubes, some EHX stuff is all sovtek, Ruby is chinese. JJ/Tesla is always their own thing.

preamp tubes usually have more effect on your overall 'tone' than powertubes will. i found jj's to be too muddy in my ampeg and cheap ass sovtek's took care of the problem and it sounds great. i suggest getting some jj's and some sovteks and mixing and matching to your liking. you may like a jj in v1, sovtek as the phase inverter etc... mix and match to find what works for you.

Think a couple of cheapy sovtek powertubes'll do the trick. and then figure out my own mix and match fun for the pre-amp?

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:19 pm

Sloan wrote:all that shit about 'balanced' tubes. fuck it, you don't need that bullshit. your playing a goddamn guitar though a guitar amp that's running through a guitar-voiced speaker. there is no need for all this bullshit. all the hype is for audiophile fucktards that think it's worth paying a little more for a slight audio advantage when they listen to ASIA though altecs and shit.

This is useful to know. Will he have to re-bias the amp if he swaps the power tubes?

euan · Post by **euan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:31 pm

listen to the demo..........

Putting a decent tube in the PI has almost no tonal benefit, V1 one has the most effect.

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:19 pm

Fran wrote:
Sloan wrote:all that shit about 'balanced' tubes. fuck it, you don't need that bullshit. your playing a goddamn guitar though a guitar amp that's running through a guitar-voiced speaker. there is no need for all this bullshit. all the hype is for audiophile fucktards that think it's worth paying a little more for a slight audio advantage when they listen to ASIA though altecs and shit.
This is useful to know. Will he have to re-bias the amp if he swaps the power tubes?

i was talking about 'balanced' preamp tubes here. you should always try and get matched power tubes. that way you can set the bias and they'll all be set good preventing some from being biased too cold or hot. i like to think of bias as similar to the idle of your automobile. you don't want it too high or low.

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:22 pm

endsjustifymeans wrote:
Sloan wrote:hey,
also, before you spend a shit on some 'mullard' tube, look up information on the real manufacturer. as far as i know the new 'mullard' tube are just different sovteks. Groove Tubes, some EHX stuff is all sovtek, Ruby is chinese. JJ/Tesla is always their own thing.

preamp tubes usually have more effect on your overall 'tone' than powertubes will. i found jj's to be too muddy in my ampeg and cheap ass sovtek's took care of the problem and it sounds great. i suggest getting some jj's and some sovteks and mixing and matching to your liking. you may like a jj in v1, sovtek as the phase inverter etc... mix and match to find what works for you.
Think a couple of cheapy sovtek powertubes'll do the trick. and then figure out my own mix and match fun for the pre-amp?

yeah, that would be cheaper.
power tubes will make a difference, but usually to me it's not as noticable as preamp tubes.

just be careful buying 'rebranded' tubes like Mesa, Groove Tube, EHX etc... they DO match tubes and stuff and rate them for gain etc, but your paying extra for it.

i like http://www.tubedepot.com - it's very easy to use. they do not mention if the tubes are rebranded or not.

other places:
http://www.tubesandmore.com
http://www.eurotubes.com (some kinda ok information here as well)

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 9:38 pm

Sloan wrote:
Fran wrote:
Sloan wrote:all that shit about 'balanced' tubes. fuck it, you don't need that bullshit. your playing a goddamn guitar though a guitar amp that's running through a guitar-voiced speaker. there is no need for all this bullshit. all the hype is for audiophile fucktards that think it's worth paying a little more for a slight audio advantage when they listen to ASIA though altecs and shit.
This is useful to know. Will he have to re-bias the amp if he swaps the power tubes?
i was talking about 'balanced' preamp tubes here. you should always try and get matched power tubes. that way you can set the bias and they'll all be set good preventing some from being biased too cold or hot. i like to think of bias as similar to the idle of your automobile. you don't want it too high or low.

Yeah, i understand most of that i was just curious if you had to set the bias after fitting matched power tubes. I read something similar on the comparison to tuning your car.
Was thinking of changing some myself but im clueless on the bias thing, suppose i could take it to a tech..

SAVEStheDAY · Post by **SAVEStheDAY** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:11 am

Sloan wrote:other places:
http://www.tubesandmore.com
http://www.eurotubes.com (some kinda ok information here as well)

Another place I've always had great luck is:

http://www.thetubestore.com

They claim to select tubes matched to the OEM standard of your make and model amp if you specify it when placing your order. In theory, even with a Marshall you could go quite a while without worrying about biasing your amp. In practice... not sure, but I've never had a problem with them on a fixed bias amp (No thanks, I'm not about to pay extra for Mesa tubes).

cobascis · Post by **cobascis** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:05 am

What is the difference between a 25 and a 30 watt 6L6?

Sloan · Post by **Sloan** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:09 am

cobascis wrote:What is the difference between a 25 and a 30 watt 6L6?

the 30 watt has more headroom!