How much should one pay for a '65 Refinished Duo II?

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Sun Mar 07, 2010 2:58 am

Saw one on ebay that is ending in 2 days. It is a nice pro-refinished Dakota Red '65 Duo II that looks in good condition. It is also local to me which is nice (no shipping!)

I've seen Duo II's go for a wide range of prices and not sure what would be a good price for one? Also, the tuners are replacements. I think everything else is original, but I am doublechecking.

hotrodperlmutter · Post by **hotrodperlmutter** » Sun Mar 07, 2010 5:35 pm

i wouldn't pay more than $700. but that's because i think anymore for a guitar is a bit foolish, based on how much i play versus look at them.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:12 am

Agreed at absolutely no more than $700 IF it is a proper Nitro refin, and the 24" scale neck. I wouldn't give more than $400 for a refin 22.5" scale. Ideally, for the refin, I wouldn't pay more than $600 even if 24" and Nitro.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:17 am

what the hell are those metal things behind the bridge plate? the saddles don't look original either.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:17 am

I went and looked. I'm not sure what the reserve price is, but I can tell you that it is more than $450.

With that original case and the 24" scale, I wouldn't be afraid to throw $600 at it if I were in the market for one.

As it is, I tossed $450 at it as you'd be retarded to let it pass by you at a price that low. This guy probably knows what he's got - I wouldn't be surprised if his reserve is around $600.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:19 am

stewart wrote:what the hell are those metal things behind the bridge plate? the saddles don't look original either.

Those threw me off as well.

He also says that the tuners are repro.

That (fairly clean) original case is really what makes it worth that extra little bit - the case alone is worth about $200.

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:45 am

cool thanks for the feedback guys!

i asked about the mystery bolts behind the bridge. He is looking into it.

Other than tuners and finish, he says all else is original, but he may be mistaken about the saddles, amongst other things. There is quite a bit unknown about it at this point.

He had it listed locally on Craigslist for $1200 for several weeks before resorting to Ebay. So there is a chance that the reserve is way more than the $600-$700 range that has been discussed here.

Definitely in the market for a Duo II, but willing to build it up with parts or modify a musicmaster if I can't get one at an affordable price.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:48 am

Only a stupid clean all original '64-'67 Duo is worth that kind of money ($1200). Possibly a gently worn in Daphne Blue model. Any kind of players grade Duo from that time period is worth about $800 IMO. No refinish is worth more than $700 when there are original examples to be found in that price range...

The mystery screws make for a pretty good hit in value as well.

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:37 am

Dice wrote:Only a stupid clean all original '64-'67 Duo is worth that kind of money ($1200). Possibly a gently worn in Daphne Blue model. Any kind of players grade Duo from that time period is worth about $800 IMO. No refinish is worth more than $700 when there are original examples to be found in that price range...

The mystery screws make for a pretty good hit in value as well.

i guess i gotta keep my eyes open. I have not found too many Duo II's. Glad i ran this one by the forum first.

I am not a huge fan of Dakota Red anyway and would probably eventually want to refinish it (so add another $300 to it eventually). My dream is to have a Mary Kay white on ash body Duo II, but buying a finished body at GuitarMill and add in a neck and all hardware and electronics and it will be one expensive guitar. Almost cheaper to buy a cheap Duo II and get it refinished.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:22 am

I wouldn't suggest refinishing an old Duo with an existing finish on it - but building one is always a viable option.

Take a look through the closed eBay auctions for an idea of what some of these have been going for. Just go to "Advanced Search" and check the box for "Completed Listings." They can be had cheap - a real deal vintage guitar for about as much as it would cost you to build a new guitar from components.

If I were to build one - I'd use a 3 way switch on the lower horn as opposed to those sliders (unless you REALLY like the out of phase thing). They always get in my way. In fact, I'm restoring an old DuoSonic and am converting it to a single pickup MusicMaster rather than have those switches in my way! That is all personal preference though.

I wasn't a fan of the red until I found a Musicmaster locally at a good price - I'm in love with it now!

Here are a couple of my red student models - the mentioned MusicMaster and my new Bronco:

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:38 am

sweet collection! i love all of the Mustang-style body guitars and hope to own a Bronco someday.

I do love the Out of Phase and need to keep that. But i can still convert to a single 3-way switch. I would leave the Bridge on all the time, and use a single 3-way switch to switch between in-phase/OFF/out-phase on the neck. I'd probably put that switch in one of the existing slots (the bridge one, since the neck switch is the one that gets in my way).

If I get a refinished Duo II, I might splurge and just go get it refinished in competition orange unless it is an ash body in which case I'd do a Mary Kay translucent white. I would not do it to an original finish guitar though. But who knows... if i get this red one on ebay, i might end up liking the red enough to keep it that way.

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:54 pm

Dice wrote: That (fairly clean) original case is really what makes it worth that extra little bit - the case alone is worth about $200.

I was interested by this comment. The vintage Mustang cases I have seen on ebay go for about $100 (sometimes even less) and even in better condition than this Duo Sonic one.

In general, should a guitar with OHSC go for $200 more than one without case?

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:04 am

Most that I have seen with "buy it now" prices are $150-250.

I think that a guitar lacking the original case might take a $50-100 hit - but it doesn't drop the value of the guitar by that amount.

As we've been discussing in another thread, individual "components" go for a lot more than their share of the value of an entire guitar - the case is no different.

A nice '65 MusicMaster will get $800 or so. But, if you tear it apart, you can get ballpark $250 for the neck, $300 for the body, $100 for the pickguard, $150 for the pickup, $75 for the loaded control plate, $100 for the tuners, $25 for the pickup cover, $50 for the neck plate and screws, $100 for the bridge, and $200 for the case. That adds up to $1350. You'd never get that much for the guitar by itself (again, unless it was an under the bed Daphne).

I'd say that you can deduct $100 when lacking a case, even though the case is "worth" much more than that. Take that $800 MusicMaster and knock it down to $700... but you wouldn't get it down to $550 just because of that missing case.

And, thanks - I love these student models as well. I may just go nuts and sell off my more "desirable" vintage guitars and use the funds for a hand full of student models!

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:17 pm

yea i am really into the student models these days.

Gonna be sniping for this Duo II before the auction ends. Hopefully the reserve price is not too high.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:23 pm

THIS musicmaster finished today.

even if you factor in the cost of adding a pickup, switches, etc that's a fairly decent price.

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:25 pm

stewart wrote:THIS musicmaster finished today.

even if you factor in the cost of adding a pickup, switches, etc that's a fairly decent price.

yep was watching that today as well. Going the MM way is definitely an attractive option.

however that particular auction is for a 22.5" scale (21 frets) so that is why i was not interested in it.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:31 pm

ah right, i didn't even look at that.

Dice · Post by **Dice** » Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:16 pm

I had my hands on that MM last week. I could have taken it out of there for $500 as it hadn't had any bids yet - but I didn't due to the 22.5" scale neck. It was pretty clean, though. That is the same guy I bought my Bronco from on Friday.

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Wed Mar 10, 2010 12:02 am

ended at $565. reserve not met. I got highest bid. I am local so he may be interested in negotiating a deal with me. will see!

glitchathon · Post by **glitchathon** » Wed Mar 10, 2010 12:22 am

heh after a bidding war that did not even reach $600, he contacted me telling me the reserve was $1200 and to let him know if i was interested. Oh well. Looks like we are on two different planets (and i am the one on Earth).

Oh well. Gonna start thinking of building one from a Guitarmill body as I really want an Ash body anyway (for transparent finishes).