Medicine Melancholy wrote:So what difference does the spacing mismatch make? Why is it an issue?
Only if you prefer one spacing over another! There's not going to be much more than a Gnats cockwidth in it really. The widths of the neck at the heel end are pretty consistent enough to not end up with outer strings stupidly too close or far from the edges to worry about it.
Since my fingers are about average size, so probably slightly large for a short scale, would the wider spacing of the TOM be a little better?
I'm also curious if that roller bridge would affect the tone, make it sound a bit more like a traditional Jag(without the strings jumping etc.). Though I'm pretty fine with how it sounds already, it's nice to have the extra sustain.
Medicine Melancholy wrote:So what difference does the spacing mismatch make? Why is it an issue?
Only if you prefer one spacing over another! There's not going to be much more than a Gnats cockwidth in it really. The widths of the neck at the heel end are pretty consistent enough to not end up with outer strings stupidly too close or far from the edges to worry about it.
Since my fingers are about average size, so probably slightly large for a short scale, would the wider spacing of the TOM be a little better?
I'm also curious if that roller bridge would affect the tone, make it sound a bit more like a traditional Jag(without the strings jumping etc.). Though I'm pretty fine with how it sounds already, it's nice to have the extra sustain.
I've seen at least one forum person mention the round roller saddles gave their jag a more trad bridge sound if that helps. The string spacing of the bridge will only impact the bridge end so if you do finger picking stuff you might like the bigger TOM spacing at that end
iCEByTes wrote:5 Most Jizz face maker Solo�s , classic Rock music i ever listened.
iCEByTes wrote:Blunt a joint , Take the Touch , Listen this.
Medicine Melancholy wrote:I imagine it would affect stuff a little up higher on the neck though? Which is where space is at a premium.
May well try the roller bridge either way.
MM - it's by tiny fractions I promise you. I know it's easy to get hung up on the minutae (god do I know that) but really there's a point where the differences are practically no differnce. anywhere below the 15 fret won't be hardly any difference at all. in fact I would wager I could hand you two guitar with you blind folded and you'd be hard pressed to guess which had a TOM and which had the trad bridge if you were only allowed to touch the board. Now stop worrying about it!
iCEByTes wrote:5 Most Jizz face maker Solo�s , classic Rock music i ever listened.
iCEByTes wrote:Blunt a joint , Take the Touch , Listen this.
Well, I think they're reasonable concerns. I don't have much money and Jags don't have the greatest reputation for being reliable so I'm just making sure it's the right "main axe" for me.
It might be a while until I see one going second hand I can afford, unless, again, I go for the HH, but after listening to clips i prefer the sound of the SS even if the functionality of the HH is cooler.
Reasonable, just I think there has to come a point when you just have to get your fingers bloody. we can tell you everything we each think but half the time we're arguing with each other about something anyway so you're unlikely to get a consensus. You're a talented person so whatever you get I can't see how you won't use it well.
iCEByTes wrote:5 Most Jizz face maker Solo�s , classic Rock music i ever listened.
iCEByTes wrote:Blunt a joint , Take the Touch , Listen this.
Dave is right.
Jags are niche, lets admit it. I think all Jag owners accept its idiosyncratic nature because its such a beauty and is unique in so many ways.
There really is'nt anymore people can tell you here other than preference of model, its one of them guitars you will buy and either love or want to love but wont get on with it.
I don't think Jags are unreliable (this is me disagreeing, see?) at all.
If you give it the right setup, they're quite stable. The trem is easily more stable than a Strat trem, tunes a lot faster too, so I never understood why it got the reputation it did. I mean, I had a Mustang bridge the whole time, but that's the only mod I ever had.
I spent a good portion of the guitar learning period on a Mustang or a Jaguar, and consequently, I think my playing style kind of evolved for those guitars, and I never once had a problem that was due to the guitar, whereas I run into all kinds of issues playing a Strat. But of course, most people start on Strats, so they don't get the "quirky" or "idiosyncratic" label attached to them, despite the fact that I think a Strat has a more unique and niche sound than a Jaguar, which I think sounds universally good in all of its non-rhythm circuit settings. I mean positions 2 and 4 on a Strat are extremely niche sounds, it's just that they've been used so much that people have gotten used to them. They're not the good but perhaps generic sounds like the N+B sound of a Jaguar, which you could use on every song and never run into issues.
Played clean in a song, can any of us really reliably tell the diff between N+B of a Jaguar, a Mustang, a Jazzmaster, or a Telecaster? I've had three of these (no Jazzmaster yet) and I couldn't. But I could stake my life on hearing B+M of a Strat. So why exactly do Jags, Mustangs, and Jazzes get the niche label slapped on them?
It's weird how differences in tone become most apparent in low gain. Though to be honest I think I could tell the difference between a Tele and Jag quite a bit of the time if I was just a little more familiar. Teles can be very honky, almost like they have the upper mid response of a high out put humbucker smushed on top of a single coil sound. In some ways I consider the Tele bridge a regular "Single Coil" sound even less than the JM.
I don't know if the Jag is the "goes with everything" guitar. I think most guitars can go with everything with the right amp and pedals, though it doesn't necessarily mean they're the best for it. Even a Tele can be pretty good for a trashy lead line in a br00tal metal track, if you use it right with the right amp.
I'd consider P90 based guitars to be that, as they really are kinda generic. That's what put me off getting a P90 guitar really. If you can deal with noise, they're the "Easiest" pickup out there.
I sure can't tell the diff. And especially considering how many pickup options there are for Teles and Jags (let's say someone has an Antiquity neck and Quarter Pound bridge), really no chance at all.
Keep in mind, the beauty of standard Jag wiring is that you can use a slightly warmer pickup and then use the strangle switch to get a slightly choked sound for when you need extra jangle.
Well, we'd have to be talking stock I guess. Though the sounds have changed a bit through the years. Some modern teles I've heard almost seem to have a "punkier" voicing than a "country" voicing in a way, though I'm unsure which teles those were.
Mustang I'm not familiar enough with, seems to be somewhere in between Jag and Strat. Of course I really need to hear more of these guitars in person where it's not someone else playing it in front of me.
Well, if we're talking stock, CIJ Jazzes and Jags basically feature Strat pickups, don't they? I don't know if that's true, my CIJ Jag had aftermarket pickups.
To me, Mustangs kind of sound like a variation on a Strat. Basically, the bridge pickup sounds very much like a Strat bridge, and the neck pickup sounds somewhere in between the middle and the neck of a Strat pickup (but closer to neck), which is probably because a Mustang neck pickup is located a bit closer to the bridge than on a Strat. That's nice because the neck can be used for some harder stuff as well. But thanks to the B+N wiring, the middle setting sounds much like a Tele B+N and then the out-of-phase is honk for miles.
honeyiscool wrote:I don't think Jags are unreliable (this is me disagreeing, see?) at all.
If you give it the right setup, they're quite stable. The trem is easily more stable than a Strat trem, tunes a lot faster too, so I never understood why it got the reputation it did. I mean, I had a Mustang bridge the whole time, but that's the only mod I ever had.
I spent a good portion of the guitar learning period on a Mustang or a Jaguar, and consequently, I think my playing style kind of evolved for those guitars, and I never once had a problem that was due to the guitar, whereas I run into all kinds of issues playing a Strat. But of course, most people start on Strats, so they don't get the "quirky" or "idiosyncratic" label attached to them, despite the fact that I think a Strat has a more unique and niche sound than a Jaguar, which I think sounds universally good in all of its non-rhythm circuit settings. I mean positions 2 and 4 on a Strat are extremely niche sounds, it's just that they've been used so much that people have gotten used to them. They're not the generic good sounds like the N+B sound of a Jaguar, which you could use on every song and never run into issues.
I agree with some of that, especially on the tremolo and reliability. Like i said about 73 pages back, once you set a Jag up its a great guitar, but a CIJ model will need setting up like no other you have known unless a previous owner has done it.
I've owned six Jaguars over the years and they take some getting used to depending on your style of playing of course. The lack of sustain and third harmonics can be an issue for some players, never mind the short scale, bridge falling to bits, pickup claws/microphonic feedback and switching system.
Strat's are more simplistic in set-up and their sound is almost industry standard along with a few other famous models of guitar. I still prefer the Jag though.
honeyiscool wrote:Well, if we're talking stock, CIJ Jazzes and Jags basically feature Strat pickups, don't they? I don't know if that's true, my CIJ Jag had aftermarket pickups.
To me, Mustangs kind of sound like a variation on a Strat. Basically, the bridge pickup sounds very much like a Strat bridge, and the neck pickup sounds somewhere in between the middle and the neck of a Strat pickup (but closer to neck), which is probably because a Mustang neck pickup is located a bit closer to the bridge than on a Strat. That's nice because the neck can be used for some harder stuff as well. But thanks to the B+N wiring, the middle setting sounds much like a Tele B+N and then the out-of-phase is honk for miles.
Some Jazzmasters had actual Strat pickups under the covers, others are JM Pickups that are thinner so sound more or less like a Strat. The Jag is almost meant to feature Strat-like pickups, but the CIJs are thinner again.
I wonder if the same is true of Japanese Strats and Teles? And Mustangs while we're at it, since they seem to be particularly popular over there?
honeyiscool wrote:I don't think Jags are unreliable (this is me disagreeing, see?) at all.
If you give it the right setup, they're quite stable. The trem is easily more stable than a Strat trem, tunes a lot faster too, so I never understood why it got the reputation it did. I mean, I had a Mustang bridge the whole time, but that's the only mod I ever had.
I spent a good portion of the guitar learning period on a Mustang or a Jaguar, and consequently, I think my playing style kind of evolved for those guitars, and I never once had a problem that was due to the guitar, whereas I run into all kinds of issues playing a Strat. But of course, most people start on Strats, so they don't get the "quirky" or "idiosyncratic" label attached to them, despite the fact that I think a Strat has a more unique and niche sound than a Jaguar, which I think sounds universally good in all of its non-rhythm circuit settings. I mean positions 2 and 4 on a Strat are extremely niche sounds, it's just that they've been used so much that people have gotten used to them. They're not the generic good sounds like the N+B sound of a Jaguar, which you could use on every song and never run into issues.
I agree with some of that, especially on the tremolo and reliability. Like i said about 73 pages back, once you set a Jag up its a great guitar, but a CIJ model will need setting up like no other you have known unless a previous owner has done it.
I've owned six Jaguars over the years and they take some getting used to depending on your style of playing of course. The lack of sustain and third harmonics can be an issue for some players, never mind the short scale, bridge falling to bits, pickup claws/microphonic feedback and switching system.
Strat's are more simplistic in set-up and their sound is almost industry standard along with a few other famous models of guitar. I still prefer the Jag though.
If I'm getting the MIM or a properly done up CIJ(as many are on the aftermarket) I should be okay though? Some of the CIJs are a bit cheaper which is appealing, but I've more or less decided on the MIM for general less hassle. Plus I really like those pickups.
honeyiscool wrote:Well, if we're talking stock, CIJ Jazzes and Jags basically feature Strat pickups, don't they? I don't know if that's true, my CIJ Jag had aftermarket pickups.
Not Jazzmasters. But in the Jags case the claw changes the magnetic path, coupled with 1m pots and completely different hardware including no tremolo sustain block it sounds completely different.
Imo the proximity of string distance from the surface of the body also makes a Strat sound more 'snappy'.
We could post demo's up of course which would throw these theories out into the water, but holding and playing these guitars for years you hear these things.
