Zaphod wrote:I know that culture doesnt equal race but when you say "guitar made for other cultures", "other cultures" implies that we have a shared culture between us. I don't know about your musical tastes, I don't know about your musicals tastes and quite often the phrase "other cultures" means people of other race and backgrounds etc so the only culture we share as far as I can see is being western and I assume white, hence me assuming you meant race.
If not that's fine but it wasn't clear.
I wasn't annoyed I was just confused as to what you were arguing.
i wasn't arguing. when someone said it looked western, i assumed country western (which often pulls from "wild west" aesthetic) and i was explaining why that was "OK" with me (that it looked western).
you cant tell me a gretsch country gent isnt made for a particular culture. or an ibanez iceman, likewise.
other cultures in no way implies we have a shared culture between us. but i was assuming that nobody playing a jazzmaster on this forum was a jazz player from the late 50s, which is who/what leo fender designed the guitar for.
BobArsecake wrote:I wouldn't refer to "jazz" as a culture, part of culture yes, but not solely.
its shorthand, referring to a time or place in culture. like "hip hop culture" or "street culture." or "wild west." or "ivy league." or "black culture." none of those things completely represent the culture referenced, but they are decent name tags for them.
Well that's something different isn't it, referring to sub-cultures and the specific values and aspects of something (relatively) small. You don't get societies based around jazz. I think you misunderstand the quote you gave. It says that culture is "...a complex whole that includes...".
BobArsecake wrote:Well that's something different isn't it, referring to sub-cultures and the specific values and aspects of something (relatively) small. You don't get societies based around jazz. I think you misunderstand the quote you gave. It says that culture is "...a complex whole that includes...".
i think you misunderstand the difference between society and culture.
the "complex whole" is the sum of its parts, and no more. if there is a common thread in a culture, it is fair to refer to that thread when referencing the culture. this has always been true and i can't believe it is even being argued here. who hasnt heard of hip hop culture? how is that different? how about beat culture? or hippy culture? why are those fair generalisations but not jazz? what about all that art created out of the socialization of all those people in that particular subset? all those associations and contributions. thats what makes up a culture.
BobArsecake wrote:Well that's something different isn't it, referring to sub-cultures and the specific values and aspects of something (relatively) small. You don't get societies based around jazz. I think you misunderstand the quote you gave. It says that culture is "...a complex whole that includes...".
i think you misunderstand the difference between society and culture.
the "complex whole" is the sum of its parts, and no more. if there is a common thread in a culture, it is fair to refer to that thread when referencing the culture. this has always been true and i can't believe it is even being argued here. who hasnt heard of hip hop culture? how is that different? how about beat culture? or hippy culture? why are those fair generalisations but not jazz? what about all that art created out of the socialization of all those people in that particular subset? all those associations and contributions. thats what makes up a culture.
You didn't say "jazz culture", you said "other cultures" which could have meant absolutely anything. Also, society creates culture. If you just meant "jazz culture" then fine, but it's not what you said.
Zaphod wrote:nah, chico's too busy backing it into a wall.
(cheap shot)
I thought the wall ran into him....
He was just trying to show Hurb how us real AMURKANS drive.... We all drive big trucks and run over anything in our way...It's kind of like a local version of our foreign policy.
They say great minds think alike....Sometimes we do too...
BobArsecake wrote:Well that's something different isn't it, referring to sub-cultures and the specific values and aspects of something (relatively) small. You don't get societies based around jazz. I think you misunderstand the quote you gave. It says that culture is "...a complex whole that includes...".
i think you misunderstand the difference between society and culture.
the "complex whole" is the sum of its parts, and no more. if there is a common thread in a culture, it is fair to refer to that thread when referencing the culture. this has always been true and i can't believe it is even being argued here. who hasnt heard of hip hop culture? how is that different? how about beat culture? or hippy culture? why are those fair generalisations but not jazz? what about all that art created out of the socialization of all those people in that particular subset? all those associations and contributions. thats what makes up a culture.
You didn't say "jazz culture", you said "other cultures" which could have meant absolutely anything. Also, society creates culture. If you just meant "jazz culture" then fine, but it's not what you said.
jazz culture falls under the umbrella of "other" for most. i apologise if that wasn't enough clarification for you. also, jazz doesnt need to create a society to create a culture, so im not sure what your point was about societies being based around jazz.
if im talking about guitars being made for other cultures, it should be obvious that i dont mean "absolutely anything," but instead other cultures of guitar players. seriously. the conversation only got generalised when zaphod jumped my shit for using the word culture.
i apologise that my comment created such a stink. i only intended to make an observation about our re-appropriation of guitars designed for other kinds of players/musics.
Zaphod wrote:this thread is like a pub thread hahaha.
it is. amazing the controversy we can work up when we mince words eh?
i think in the future i need to be more careful that people dont think i am all bent out of shape when im not. this isn't the first time this has happened.
right on.