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honeyiscool wrote:... some morose 24 year old dudes who have nothing good about them and think that having good taste makes them interesting but it doesn't

Makes life worth living

honeyiscool wrote:I'd rather target them than some morose 24 year old dudes who have nothing good about them and think that having good taste makes them interesting but it doesn't

I'm 33 thank you very much...

honeyiscool wrote:Elitism never looks good on anybody.

But isn't the very nature of that comment elitist?

MCR is bad music. I don't care if people listen to, and I even understand the appeal (a little), but I don't think they're good at what they do. Even for the style they play and the audience they target, there are better bands to listen to.

They're pretty bad... even for a hot topic band. I actually enjoy that "I'm not ok" song though... call it a guilty pleasure.

I don't know what bad music is, I've never heard it described to me well, and I'm not sure if MCR is indeed bad for their genre. I mean, I enjoy bands like Taking Back Sunday and some AFI or Avenged Sevenfold, but I don't think MCR is quite in the same vein and what I've heard of them definitely doesn't put them in the same bag as the other such bands you're probably thinking of. I mean, just because it's easy and obvious to group bands by their style of dress doesn't mean musically the comparison has any merit.

A lot of people seem to enjoy them and they seem to be more than competent at what they're doing and they've shown longevity. Hence, I don't see what makes them so obviously bad to you or anybody.

There's plenty of artists and bands who not that many people enjoy, aren't that competent, and haven't shown particular longevity, that people rave about and don't consider unquestionably bad, so.

I think the crux of the issue is you seem to enjoy a type of music that I pretty much have utter disdain for. Bands like Avenged Sevenfold and TBS literally make me want to jam pencils in my ears, though I admit I do like some AFI. At the same time I know people who cringe at the sound of Melvins, Boris or Sunn O))). To each their own... Bad music is completely subjective. What is bad to me may be solid gold to someone else, I mean Britney Spears and New Kids on The Block made millions from music I wouldn't even wipe my ass with so people out their clearly have differing opinions then mine.

MCR and they're whole mall rat emo culture is poo-poo from where I'm sitting but I'm sure those kids feel the same bout punk and noise rock.

honeyiscool wrote:A lot of people seem to enjoy them and they seem to be more than competent at what they're doing and they've shown longevity. Hence, I don't see what makes them so obviously bad to you or anybody.

by those standards, the Backstreet Boys would be in the top 10 for greatest bands of all time.

But just because I like some of that music doesn't mean I was ever part of the culture you dislike either, or that I was ever fond of many bands of that genre, just the few I did enjoy.

It's a little lame to dismiss bands on their mode of dress because there were plenty of girly men who dressed like girly men who made music that you probably love. *insert ziggy stardust picture here* I'm not saying Gerard Way is anything to be compared to David Bowie but I doubt seeing a picture of David Bowie in his gayest outfit would make most men run out and buy a Bowie album, so it's probably best to let those attacks sit.

Whatever, I'm not that invested into defending MCR because I don't care for them musically, but I feel like I can't just sit back and let them be an easy target for people based on their fanbase and their style of dress because then, plenty of bands I do like will get swept under that attack without ever being given a fair chance. And I know at least one other person who'll listen to Paramore today and Stone Roses tomorrow and Squirrel Bait the next, so it's not true that if you like mallcore "emo," you automatically know nothing about music.

portugalwillie wrote:by those standards, the Backstreet Boys would be in the top 10 for greatest bands of all time.

My standards didn't make MCR a great band. My standards said that success and longevity probably means that there's something you don't get about them, that they probably don't completely suck. And I think Backstreet Boys are great for what they are, a pop band. They had great songs and entertained a lot of people and for people of my age, they do bring back childhood memories and everyone knows all the words to "I Want It That Way." It does bring people closer together, the way that a lot of indie rock and stuff of that nature really doesn't, they make people stand out from the crowd instead, but being different just on the account of liking something different doesn't make people interesting, like I said.

endsjustifymeans wrote:To each their own... Bad music is completely subjective. What is bad to me may be solid gold to someone else, I mean Britney Spears and New Kids on The Block made millions from music I wouldn't even wipe my ass with so people out their clearly have differing opinions then mine.

this. I have the right to say that MCR is terrible music and everyone else has the right to tell me the music I listen to is terrible. I don't see why everyone has to defend the music they listen to. I have every Dave Matthews Band CD ever released. I don't give a fuck what you think about them, they're great.

portugalwillie wrote:this. I have the right to say that MCR is terrible music and everyone else has the right to tell me the music I listen to is terrible. I don't see why everyone has to defend the music they listen to. I have every Dave Matthews Band CD ever released. I don't give a fuck what you think about them, they're great.

I don't see why everyone has to insult the music they're completely ignorant to either.

It's one thing if people gave a band a completely fair chance, heard them and judged them in a vacuum, and then had some decent criticism about them. It's quite another thing if people saw a picture of a band, assumed they wouldn't like it, and when you're in that mindset, everything sounds terrible, and most people who diss on MCR probably heard like half of an MCR song, if that.

Shit, if I gave Liz Phair a half a song to shine, I'd still think she was shit.

honeyiscool wrote: It's a little lame to dismiss bands on their mode of dress because there were plenty of girly men who dressed like girly men who made music that you probably love. *insert ziggy stardust picture here* I'm not saying Gerard Way is anything to be compared to David Bowie but I doubt seeing a picture of David Bowie in his gayest outfit would make most men run out and buy a Bowie album, so it's probably best to let those attacks sit.

I'd never judge a band by their style of dress. I've gone to see bands wearing bunny costumes before. Dressing feminine or outrageous is absolutely no reason to thing a band won't kick your eardrums ass. Case in point... The New York Dolls.

Fuck I wear skin tight pants, have long hair and have been known to rock some guyliner (granted I'm a horrible musician). Half these bands don't have shit on my early teen Robert Smith worshipping Goth phase.

Also listening to shit band doesn't mean you have bade taste or know nothing about music. I listen to plenty of bands I think are awful... there's a reason it's called a guilty pleasure. I was rocking out to Gallows on the way in to work today and they're TERRIBLE... I'll rock REO Speedwagon and not give two shits that the people in the car next to me are looking at me funny. I know it's shit rock, but it makes me happy.

But the thing is I know that music sucks... I know it's mindless radio drone. But you know what... man can't live on Filet Mignon alone, sometime we just need a bag of Dorritos.

honeyiscool wrote:t's one thing if people gave a band a completely fair chance, heard them and judged them in a vacuum, and then had some decent criticism about them. It's quite another thing if people saw a picture of a band, assumed they wouldn't like it, and when you're in that mindset, everything sounds terrible, and most people who diss on MCR probably heard like half of an MCR song, if that.

I call bullshit.

First off, if you have a tv or radio it's impossible that you haven't heard every Fall Out Boy or MCR radio hit at some point or another. Bands like that get solid media saturation.

Second off, I try to give everything a fair shake. Unless they're on Victory Records... fuck some lame ass metal core, that shit is just insulting. If I don't find at least a new band/album a week that I've never heard before... it's a very bad week for me. I'm an avid ingestor of ALL things music. From persian folk to modern country, I'll give anything a try.

Well I don't believe in guilty pleasures. If it's on the radio, it's catchy and gets stuck in your head, it probably means it has a good melody or a good hook, and that's at least enough to make a song far from bad because there's plenty of music I've heard described as good that have little in the sense of melody or harmony that I'm supposed to "get" but melody is something I do get and it's something I like about music.

And of course, I think most of us do like bands with a lot of dandies in them. So why all the comments about the bassist looking like a girl? That's just uncalled for, and yeah, I'm a little frail boy with a love for pink guitars, so I think that stuff definitely makes me uncomfortable. If it's just harmless fun, that's fine, but people could stand to be a little bit more creative than someone looks like a girl. Otherwise how are they any better than the bands they're dissing?

honeyiscool wrote:I don't see why everyone has to insult the music they're completely ignorant to either.

It's one thing if people gave a band a completely fair chance, heard them and judged them in a vacuum, and then had some decent criticism about them.

From the comments previously in the thread, most people seem to be coming at their criticism from this sort of standpoint. They've heard them, they think they're trash.

honeyiscool wrote:... most people who diss on MCR probably heard like half of an MCR song, if that.

Sometimes, that's all it takes.
Take... oh, Nickleback. You've heard 30 sec. of a song, you've pretty much heard their discography

honeyiscool wrote:Shit, if I gave Liz Phair a half a song to shine, I'd still think she was shit.

As awesome as some of her stuff is... she still kinda is shit

endsjustifymeans wrote:First off, if you have a tv or radio it's impossible that you haven't heard every Fall Out Boy or MCR radio hit at some point or another. Bands like that get solid media saturation.

Only if you're watching MTV every day. If you're the average Joe who catches NFL and NBA games here and there and a little sitcom now and then, shit, you might actually hear more Peter Bjorn and John than MCR because MCR has less general appeal than Peter Bjorn and John, who are pleasing enough to put in a commercial or a sporting montage, and I've heard them in both contexts.

And let's not group MCR and FOB. Fall Out Boy is actually pretty damn awesome and I think even most haters agree that their first album was pretty fantastic.

Ankhanu wrote:
As awesome as some of her stuff is... she still kinda is shit

Exile in Guyville was brilliant. She had nowhere to go but down hill from there.

Some artists really only have one albums worth of work in them, she is one of those artists.

Hell, even some tracks on Liz Phair were pretty good... though in a completely different context. But, yeah, by and large she just went *pphhbbttttpppptt*

Ankhanu wrote:Sometimes, that's all it takes.
Take... oh, Nickleback. You've heard 30 sec. of a song, you've pretty much heard their discography

Haha.

I think half a song is enough to know you'll never like that artist. Once you know that fact, then you don't need to hear any more of them, therefore you'll never really find out if they're not to your liking because they're not to your liking, or whether they're as "bad" as you think they are, whatever bad means. If you listen to an artist carefully knowing you know you're going to hate them, you just enjoy torture, or proving yourself right is more important than having fun, and I'm not sure how I feel about those people.

Ankhanu wrote:Hell, even some tracks on Liz Phair were pretty good... though in a completely different context. But, yeah, by and large she just went *pphhbbttttpppptt*

Half the songs would be pretty good, if, say, Avril Lavigne had sung them (and I actually love Avril). But really, without a great song, you remember what a shit singer Liz Phair is. Hah.

Nah, honeyiscool, it's not even about knowing that you hate them in 30 sec... it's knowing that that is what they sound like. AC/DC is a classic example of this too.
You might love AC/DC or Nickleback, but still, their songs are going to all sound just about the same, with some variation. The sound, the themes, the song construction, it's all pretty formulaic. It's, I suppose, those slight variations on the theme that drive people that love this music wild, but it's the monotonous predictability and blandness that drive other people to madness.

My point was simply as I stated it; sometimes you don't need to listen to a lot of what a band has to offer to know what they're all about.