Swinger

NickS · Post by **NickS** » Thu Nov 17, 2011 8:24 pm

Mike wrote:Man they really didn't make a lot of these things.

IIRC, one of the books (50 years of Fender?) quotes one of two guys responsible for actually doing the work as saying they did somewhere between 200 and 300.

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:19 pm

Below is some information I copied and condensed from various books about Fender and internet blogs:

The Swinger was devised by Virgilio "Babe" Simoni who was the head of Fender's blank, body and sanding department. According to Simoni, only 250 to 300 Swingers were ever built and the Swinger was never featured in Fender's literature. Simoni also created the Maverick/Custom. Simoni estimated production to be around 600 to 800 completed pieces.

Even though people like to point out the Swinger and Customs as atrocities of the CBS era,Simoni was a longtime Fender employee. He started working at Fender in 1953(his father also worked there) and had a hand in the creation of just about every guitar they made. Working with Roger Rossmeisl in The CBS era Babe was instrumental in creating the Telecaster Thinline. When Leo Fender and George Fullerton founded MusicMan, Simoni jumped ship to join them.

hotrodperlmutter · Post by **hotrodperlmutter** » Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:30 pm

SSSSSSSSSSSABOTAGE

kapepepper · Post by **kapepepper** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:16 am

westtexasred wrote:Below is some information I copied and condensed from various books about Fender and internet blogs:

The Swinger was devised by Virgilio "Babe" Simoni who was the head of Fender's blank, body and sanding department. According to Simoni, only 250 to 300 Swingers were ever built and the Swinger was never featured in Fender's literature. Simoni also created the Maverick/Custom. Simoni estimated production to be around 600 to 800 completed pieces.

Even though people like to point out the Swinger and Customs as atrocities of the CBS era,Simoni was a longtime Fender employee. He started working at Fender in 1953(his father also worked there) and had a hand in the creation of just about every guitar they made. Working with Roger Rossmeisl in The CBS era Babe was instrumental in creating the Telecaster Thinline. When Leo Fender and George Fullerton founded MusicMan, Simoni jumped ship to join them.

Golden age states the same. Many with fender didnt even know about the guitar

The book also said these were indeed visual atrocities, but high quality, excellent sounding guitars
And Simoni was just doing as was ordered by his supervisors

He did still a ngood job on the swinger, i think the maverick*/custom thats were it went out of hand

(and the prce tag was 20 USD more then a regular tele)

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:59 am

Knowing now that there's only like 300 real ones in existence, I feel like assuming that half of the ones on the internet are fake. I don't know why, it just seems like if they are in THAT short of supply then they'd all be in the hands of collectors by now.

Sven · Post by **Sven** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:37 pm

Nick wrote:Knowing now that there's only like 300 real ones in existence, I feel like assuming that half of the ones on the internet are fake. I don't know why, it just seems like if they are in THAT short of supply then they'd all be in the hands of collectors by now.

I am guessing the production number is higher than 300. I've seen a couple homemade jobs, but I've never seen one that was an intentional fake. They are way too much work to fake. Plus 22.5" scale necks are not easy to come by.

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:22 pm

Nick wrote:Knowing now that there's only like 300 real ones in existence, I feel like assuming that half of the ones on the internet are fake. I don't know why, it just seems like if they are in THAT short of supply then they'd all be in the hands of collectors by now.

the collectors are only really interested in pre CBS stuff, and even then, only strats and teles if we're being honest. jags and jazzmasters are increasing in price, but only because they're the last 'quality' pre CBS fenders that most people could even hope to afford. it's still commonly stated that mustangs are "children's guitars."

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:31 pm

I think it may look like there are more of swingers out there than there really are. below is a photo of my Swinger and photos of the same guitar as it appeared in ads by 3 different dealers.

Sven · Post by **Sven** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:59 pm

Good point, it appears your guitar went from an Unknown Location, to California, to Illinois, to Texas (err....assuming you live in Texas).

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 2:46 pm

Minnesota actually,long story,anyway....I saw in the 2011 Vintage Guitar Price Guide they list the Swinger under the name "Musiclander", Why? Where did that name come from?

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:51 pm

it's one of the names it was known as, 'arrow' was another. similar to the maverick also being called the custom on occasion.

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:12 pm

stewart wrote:it's one of the names it was known as, 'arrow' was another. similar to the maverick also being called the custom on occasion.

I found out that there is actually a difference between the Maverick and the Custom.The difference is that the Maverick was the first run made with re-purposed Fender XII necks that had a Maverick decal applied. Apparently Fender had more surplus Fender XII bodies than necks so when they ran out they made new necks and put a Custom decal on those. There is an article about them in the new Premier Guitar Magazine "Spring Cleaning"(Link)

stewart · Post by **stewart** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:16 pm

interesting.

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 8:00 pm

This is a nice Swinger on Ebay for $1879.00 (Link)

more pics

► Show Spoiler

westtexasred · Post by **westtexasred** » Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:31 pm

What ever became of the Competition Orange Swinger?

hotrodperlmutter · Post by **hotrodperlmutter** » Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:38 pm

cooters was finished

http://shortscale.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=41602

bfloyd6969 · Post by **bfloyd6969** » Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:16 am

westtexasred wrote:Minnesota actually,long story,anyway....I saw in the 2011 Vintage Guitar Price Guide they list the Swinger under the name "Musiclander", Why? Where did that name come from?

http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/Bodies/Mo ... ander.aspx

http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/necks/arr ... thpro.aspx

Been wanting to build one of these for a while now...

Mages · Post by **Mages** » Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:42 am

westtexasred wrote:I found out that there is actually a difference between the Maverick and the Custom.The difference is that the Maverick was the first run made with re-purposed Fender XII necks that had a Maverick decal applied. Apparently Fender had more surplus Fender XII bodies than necks so when they ran out they made new necks and put a Custom decal on those.

yeah interesting. the cut-out on the swinger makes sense because they were cutting around the bass v string-through holes, there doesn't seem to be any reason for the maverick and custom body modifications though. and with the custom, they could have even given it a regular jazzmaster neck instead of the hockey stick headstock. they were just going out of their way to make a weird guitar.

crumpler · Post by **crumpler** » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:56 am

I'd never heard of the Swinger.

It's cool, in a kinda weird and wonky way.
Nice pics.

Phil O'Keefe · Post by **Phil O'Keefe** » Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:24 pm

If only Fender had made a 24" scale Swinger - I would have been all over that by now. 22.5" is just too small for me. I'd happily take that Fender XII though...