ShortScale.org

Three different approaches, as I see it, to a valid need. What will become the standard?

Gibson Robot tuning: Has the advantage of being organic, automatic, and self-contained. As disadvantage the tuners are still noisy and fragile, the accuracy is lower than a standard tuner, and string fatigue is a concern. Also, Gibson owns the technology, so it's expensive to buy and we won't be seeing other companies picking it up anytime soon. Severely altered pitches also cause problems with string tension and intonation.

Polyphonic Pitch-Shifting: Morpheus Drop-Tune only works for variations on standard, but the Variax and Roland guitar synth allow virtual open tunings. This system is cheaper than a specialized Robot guitar, but is digital and therefore artificial. I've also heard that it feels strange to play a guitar in standard, yet hear an open tuning from the amp. In the case of the Variax, the tunings can be changed instantaneously using a 5-way switch.

Lots of guitars: Guitars are cheaper and better than ever, so having lots in different tunings makes sense. It's cumbersome, but organic and fun. This has been the standard, but it is very inconvenient compared to something like the Variax.

I think the polyphonic stuff is cool, but for true tuning and getting the real feel to come across I thinks lots of guitars the the route to go.

lots o guitars mate.

I've played Robot gibsons, nothing too great, they were always a bit out of tune even after you started tweaking it yourself, and the intonation was never right on the open tunings. Nice, but it just sounds bad once you start playing it. You might as well take the time to actually tune the guitar.

Played a VG-Stratocaster. Albeit not the BEST at the whole virtual simulation thing but its Roland, definitely one of the better ones. The VG strat i played sounded pretty cool on the 12 string and acoustic mode, especially together. But the open tunings and even the drop tunings occasionally glitched. Sounded bland to me, i wasn't feeling it.

I'd say indiviual guitars is the way to go. I have 4 guitars around the house that i play somewhat daily depending on what i'm playing, usually all in different tunings. Standard, open G, down a half step and "new standard"
each guitar is intonated and has the appropriate string gauges and it's just the only way to go. why fake it?

Unless they find a cure for GAS it will always be more guitars. For god sakes, its one of my main go to reasons for why I have more than one guitar when the wife starts moaning about them taking up so much room.

I saw one of the Gibsons in the shop today. That shit is awesome and fucking dumb at the same time. I think I'd rather get a shipping palette full of $50 First Act guitars and do every tuning under the sun except ABCDEFG, Mogwai style.

I voted Slaon - no real winner.

Re automatic tuning;
Tronical, who developed the technology used by Gibson, seem to have agreed an exclusive deal with Gibson - there isn't even a mention of Steve Vai's Strat on their site any more. The alternative, used or atleast tried by Jimmy Page, EVH, etc. is the Transperformance Performer. Big advantage of the Tronical system is no big mods to the guitar body whereas:

What changes does the Performer installation make to my guitar?
The installation does not interfere with the existing guitar audio circuits. From a sound standpoint, the only change we've measured is a modest increase in sustain. Some wood is removed and replaced with the computer and mechanical device. We add a locking nut and roller bridge to facilitate accuracy. The retrofit adds approximately 8 ounces to the original weight of your guitar, depending on the wood density of the guitar.

and so they basically have one shop that sells modified guitars.

Ever heard of Andy McKee? He has individual tuning for (almost) each of his songs. He has about three guitars I think, one of them is baritone or something. When performing live he just tunes it by hand between songs.

So another option might be to just get very good at tuning

When the gibson robot tunes your guitar, does it need to be set up again? That would be kinda funny. Is it just a machine that moves the tuning pegs for you or is it all digital?

JJLipton wrote:a machine that moves the tuning pegs for you

This. It has piezo bridge saddles that detect the note played by the string and motorised machine heads powered through the strings. It's computerised with a control knob that allows you to select the tuning to use. Latest model appears to do some digital signal processing too, you can change the EQ on the guitar.
Go to Gibson and take a look.
It doesn't cope if you knock a string off the bridge.

individual guitars.

Back when I gigged a bit more, I primarily had 3 guitars on stage....

Taylor t-5 for standard tuning and for acoustic tones (Set up with 11s)
Tele set up in dropped D and heavier strings (12's) (and used as a backup for th t5 in case of string break)
Strat in open E set up with 11s

I don't care what you guys think- GIBSON ROBOT FTW

I tried a Variax and, with the amp loud enough (so that you're not hearing the guitar acoustically), the "faked" alt tunings are convincing enough. I guess you could say it doesn't quite "feel" right (since it doesn't have the reduced tension that tuning down gives you), but it will eliminate the intonation or action problems you get from switching tunings on one guitar.

Embrace technology for the lols, don't be cavemans.

DUSK TIGER clearly wins ALL guitar debates of ALL time!!!!
WAIT!, something isn't sitting right in my stomach after that sentence.
I think I just threw up in my mouth a lil' bit.

I think if I had to pick one for myself, money being no object, I'd go for the Variax. It's just a brilliant piece of technology.

You could buy 5 semi-decent guitars for the price of a Gibson Robot, multiples of guitars everytime.

The earlier model robots are going under a grand actually which is only a few hundred over the lower-end USA gibsons. Still, i'd just stick with a standard guitar even if it were the same price

there is a new robot les paul studio at the GC near me for 950 right now. Not bad price. I just do not lie it that much. It felt weird and seemed a tiny bit off.

Here's a Robot anecdote. One of the lads who comes to the jam turned up with a Robot Les Paul a few months back. He wa really pleased with it. A couple of weeks later his band had a gig there that we went to. During the break he was showing someone how it worked. After the break the band started again and after a short while he realised he'd left the guitar in the wrong tuning. It was about 20 seconds into the song before he had got it all sorted. A couple of songs later he pulled a string off the saddle and couldn't work out why it wouldn't re-tune.

The whole thing was such a fiasco, in his eyes, that he's never got over it and mostly brings his Epi Les Paul. He was talking again recently about getting the guitar converted to non-robot.

Adding the weight of the electric tuners to an SG or Flying V didn't seem like a good move to me - they're already neck-heavy.

As for the Gibson Robot, they should have left the servo motors in the bridge like the original automated tuner - solves all the problems with the tuning machines.

NickS wrote:Here's a Robot anecdote. One of the lads who comes to the jam turned up with a Robot Les Paul a few months back. He wa really pleased with it. A couple of weeks later his band had a gig there that we went to. During the break he was showing someone how it worked. After the break the band started again and after a short while he realised he'd left the guitar in the wrong tuning. It was about 20 seconds into the song before he had got it all sorted. A couple of songs later he pulled a string off the saddle and couldn't work out why it wouldn't re-tune.

The whole thing was such a fiasco, in his eyes, that he's never got over it and mostly brings his Epi Les Paul. He was talking again recently about getting the guitar converted to non-robot.

sounds like user error, nothing wrong with the guitar.

aye, if you don't notice that your guitar is in the wrong tuning until partway through a song you might just need a little more help than a robot guitar can provide.

personally i think the robot guitar is solving a problem that doesn't exist. the variax is a much better integration of digital circuitry into a guitar.