"Upgrade" caps

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:13 am

A buddy's been encouraging me to put a Sprague Bumblebee in my reissue Duo-Sonic.

Before making my decision, I played it the other night through several amps and pedals. I got so many different tones that I began to wonder what I would actually accomplish by changing the cap?

What do you think?

jcyphe · Post by **jcyphe** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:34 am

If you like it why would you let somebody convince you to change it?

foofoo982 · Post by **foofoo982** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:34 am

Do you like the amp you have? When I play my guitar through other amps/speaker cabinets I notice the amp more. Granted I don't know much about how much a new cap will help in the guitar, but I remember the Duo-Sonics sounding nice. After upgrading amps a lot of the things I thought were my guitar tone-wise were actually my amps.

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:37 am

jcyphe wrote:If you like it why would you let somebody convince you to change it?

I'm relatively new to playin electric...30 months now...so I'm learnin a lot fast, and still don't know what I don't know.

Anyway, I think I'm learnin a new lesson here. That a good amp adds a world of tones to any decent guitar. And that the peripherals can add a universe of tones to that. So I'm not so concerned that my guitars...from my little old '65 Mustang to my reissue Duo-Sonic...need upgrading.

Thanks, guys. I needed a little confirmation from players who know more than me.

jcyphe · Post by **jcyphe** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:03 am

Doug wrote:
jcyphe wrote:If you like it why would you let somebody convince you to change it?
I'm relatively new to playin electric...30 months now...so I'm learnin a lot fast, and still don't know what I don't know.

Anyway, I think I'm learnin a new lesson here. That a good amp adds a world of tones to any decent guitar. And that the peripherals can add a universe of tones to that. So I'm not so concerned that my guitars...from my little old '65 Mustang to my reissue Duo-Sonic...need upgrading.

Thanks, guys. I needed a little confirmation from players who know more than me.

What I was saying is it sounds like you got your own process going. Don't let somebody else tell you what's supposed to be the right way. Discovery is part of the fun as is coming up with your own process.

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:18 pm

The only time i've changed caps is either because a guitar is too dull or too bright.
Sometimes it helps and is less hassle than changing pot values etc.

Ankhanu · Post by **Ankhanu** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:31 pm

Doug wrote:
jcyphe wrote:If you like it why would you let somebody convince you to change it?
I'm relatively new to playin electric...30 months now...so I'm learnin a lot fast, and still don't know what I don't know.

Anyway, I think I'm learnin a new lesson here. That a good amp adds a world of tones to any decent guitar. And that the peripherals can add a universe of tones to that. So I'm not so concerned that my guitars...from my little old '65 Mustang to my reissue Duo-Sonic...need upgrading.

Thanks, guys. I needed a little confirmation from players who know more than me.

Unlike with acoustic guitar, in which the guitar itself is 100% of the instrument, electric guitars are a much larger "instrument". The guitar itself is just one component... like the bridge is a component. The entire chain of components, from the guitar, through effects to the amp make an electric instrument, no one part is really more important than the others in the end result (well, there are degrees of importance). Changing out anything will alter the sound and sound capability. The guitar is important, but the amp is just as important in translating the string vibration to sound and shaping how that sound... well... sounds

A cap change will change things, but less so than other aspects. As has been mentioned, just use your ears. Are you happy with the sound you're getting? If so, don't change anything

There are other was to shape your sound that will have more dramatic effect (ie. pedals, amps), though they will cost a lot more than a cap change too.

George · Post by **George** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:41 pm

Courtesy of portugalwillie's posting this week:

[youtube][/youtube]

In this instance I can hear a difference between a few but it's mostly negligible. Considering I thought it "MADE NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER FUCK YOU CORKSNIFFER" this video has changed my opinion quite a lot. It can make a difference.

If it costs $2 to make it sound better to you, or you're just inquisitive then why the hell not. It's your money and your guitar.

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:44 pm

GeorgeF wrote:Courtesy of portugalwillie's posting this week:

[youtube][/youtube]

In this instance I can hear a difference between a few but it's mostly negligible. Considering I thought it "MADE NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER FUCK YOU CORKSNIFFER" this video has changed my opinion quite a lot. It can make a difference.

If it costs $2 to make it sound better to you, or you're just inquisitive then why the hell not. It's your money and your guitar.

Just watched all them videos, brilliant!
I must say the original Epi cap was easily the worst to my ears and i dont believe the text cue'd me to think that either.

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:28 am

Thanks for finding this for us, George.

Great idea, to do this caps test. He seems to play each demo exactly the same...hard to control for that attack variable but he seems to control it. In fact, I closed my eyes as I listened and I had no idea he'd tested all the caps. Every repetition, he sounded identical to my ears. So...

I'll keep playin with my guitar tone setting, pickup combinations, and amp settings. When I've learned all the tones I can get with all those variables, I'll start using my Boss Distortion/Overdrive pedal. Should take me about two years to discover every tone possibility with all those variables to play with.

Then I may invest $30.00 USD or so in upgrade pots.

NickS · Post by **NickS** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:14 am

He didn't say anything about the tolerances of the caps, which may range from on-the-button to +/- 20%. So your 0.022uF could be anything between 0.0176uF and 0.0264uF. That will make a measurable and quite possibly an audible tonal difference between capacitors of the same nominal value from the same manufacturer in terms of the corner & cut-off frequencies.

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:16 am

He mentions that in the Q&A video.

NickS · Post by **NickS** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:19 am

Fran wrote:He mentions that in the Q&A video.

Guess he had a few people mention that, then!

gaybear · Post by **gaybear** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:21 am

this thread reminds me of when i was hopping with my dad for my second amp, when i was about 14 or 15. He doesn't play music, but noticed the significant difference in how the same guitar would sound on different amps. He in fact, asked the store owner, "How come he (me) sounds good on this one, but sounds like shit on the other one?" I think he made the owner feel awkward. anyway, we got the one that i didn't sound like "shit" on. i don't even remember what it was, haha

George · Post by **George** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:39 am

The cap shouldn't make a difference if the tone is on ten, no?

Post by **Doog** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:44 am

Yet more time spent away from PLAYING THE GUITAR.

George · Post by **George** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:47 am

Doog wrote:Yet more time spent away from PLAYING THE GUITAR.

IRONIC POST IS IRONIC

johnnyseven · Post by **johnnyseven** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:12 pm

I had Orange Drops put in both my main guitars when I had them set up a while back. They did seem to make a big difference in sound but I think the guy may have adjusted the pickup heights at the same time so it could have been that.

Fran · Post by **Fran** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:52 pm

I usually use orange drop caps but I ordered a nos paper and oil cap for the Mustang. The seller said you can get a blooze lawyer tone with them.

George · Post by **George** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:54 pm

I use orange drops because they look nice, and they're easy for me to man handle while I solder the innards terribly.