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broncobuster80 wrote:

Ankhanu wrote:

broncobuster80 wrote:I have been giving guitar/bass/drum lessons for years and not one time ever had someone ask how to play anything that Marr has been involved with. Ive never seen anyone come in the shop and say "Id like to have this set up like the guitar Marr plays".

I'm guessing you're working/teaching out of a guitar shop? I'm not looking for credentials here... no cock-measuring (I couldn't teach anyone to play, so it'd be silly to call you out)... but I am going to make some assumptions, please correct me if I'm wrong

I don't really see students approaching teachers with "teach me to play..." as really being much of a measure of a guitar player's quality... students often don't know shit, or have somewhat limited experiences (gross generalization), and only know a handful of players/contributions, and generally only withing their favorite genres. I'm willing to wager that you don't get too many students asking you to teach them any Quintette du Hot Club de France (Django Reinhardt), Chet Atkins, Pat Metheney, etc. songs either... but they are all undeniably phenomenal guitar players with tremendous influence. Not saying Marr is in their league, but ya know, the measure is off

I never said the guy couldnt play.. he plays well but not to the point of Django or Chet and he sure has not changed the face of music as we know it (ie Lennon, Hendrix, Cobain, Corgan, Marley, Space Ace and Rhoads)
The most heard names as far as "can you show me how ______ plays" are Cobain, Lennon, Atkins, Hendrix and SRV... (those are the ones that come to mind right now, there are tons of others). Yeah I teach out of a musical instrument retail store, and no im not saying Im even in the same galaxy of a "great" guitar player. I do my best with my playing and teaching the instruments, its all one can do.

Would also just like to say that Marr was never a part of Talking Heads, he did do session work with them and toured as a guitar player for a short time.

you're clearly talking from an american perspective, and that's fine, but there are other places in the world where people make music. a whole generation of people say you're wrong.

plus- you get people asking you to how to play like john lennon? what does john lennon's guitar playing sound like? completely basic. and SRV, as far as i'm concerned all he did was drive up the price of bassmans and tubescreamers, his music is fucking wack. he changed music for boring white man bloozehounds maybe, but nobody else.

stewart wrote:

broncobuster80 wrote:

Ankhanu wrote: I'm guessing you're working/teaching out of a guitar shop? I'm not looking for credentials here... no cock-measuring (I couldn't teach anyone to play, so it'd be silly to call you out)... but I am going to make some assumptions, please correct me if I'm wrong

I don't really see students approaching teachers with "teach me to play..." as really being much of a measure of a guitar player's quality... students often don't know shit, or have somewhat limited experiences (gross generalization), and only know a handful of players/contributions, and generally only withing their favorite genres. I'm willing to wager that you don't get too many students asking you to teach them any Quintette du Hot Club de France (Django Reinhardt), Chet Atkins, Pat Metheney, etc. songs either... but they are all undeniably phenomenal guitar players with tremendous influence. Not saying Marr is in their league, but ya know, the measure is off

I never said the guy couldnt play.. he plays well but not to the point of Django or Chet and he sure has not changed the face of music as we know it (ie Lennon, Hendrix, Cobain, Corgan, Marley, Space Ace and Rhoads)
The most heard names as far as "can you show me how ______ plays" are Cobain, Lennon, Atkins, Hendrix and SRV... (those are the ones that come to mind right now, there are tons of others). Yeah I teach out of a musical instrument retail store, and no im not saying Im even in the same galaxy of a "great" guitar player. I do my best with my playing and teaching the instruments, its all one can do.

Would also just like to say that Marr was never a part of Talking Heads, he did do session work with them and toured as a guitar player for a short time.

you're clearly talking from an american perspective, and that's fine, but there are other places in the world where people make music. a whole generation of people say you're wrong.

plus- you get people asking you to how to play like john lennon? what does john lennon's guitar playing sound like? completely basic. and SRV, as far as i'm concerned all he did was drive up the price of bassmans and tubescreamers, his music is fucking wack. he changed music for boring white man bloozehounds maybe, but nobody else.

Thank fuck someone around here talks sense. At a time when every other band were off dressing up and pissing about on synths, Marr was cooking up magical, chiming goodness. All of the music lessons I ever took were spent learning The Smiths, and he's so much better technically than people give him credit for. He's shit now like, but his legacy lives on

Fucking Cobain...he played all of his riffs just using the low E, didn't he?

If Marr was crap & influenced so few how come there are a number of videos by people on this very site playing his tunes????

I definitely was searching youtube the other day for the cure, and every search brought up a zillion people playing cure songs, all on Ric guitars. I assume that means he does in fact have influence.

broncobuster80 wrote:
Would also just like to say that Marr was never a part of Talking Heads, he did do session work with them and toured as a guitar player for a short time.

So he toured with them played guitar on their album but wasn't part of the band, what do you have to do to be considered part of a band in your mind...

It's one thing to not dig a person's music, that's all opinion. But to just make ludicrous and uninformed statements about somebody's technique and influence is ridiculous.

Agree with Srewart entirely. Honestly I've never read a thread with so much utter shit said about some fine bands and at least one great guitarist. I'm not talking about Limp Bizkit. Fucking sort it out Shortscale! Of course Marr is legendary in certain circles because he wrote some amazing understated guitar parts for great songs, end fucking of.

Dave wrote:Of course Marr is legendary in certain circles because he wrote some amazing understated guitar parts for great songs, end fucking of.

AMEN!

Noel Gallagher on Marr... "Theres nothing he cannot do on a guitar... The mans a fookin' wizard"



Regardless of what you think of Mr Gallgher he hits a very large number of nails on the head in this interview... Morrissey, Marr...

no im not trolling

with that said im stepping away from it

I edited my post, sorry for calling you a troll. My bad.

if i was to rank Marr, Cobain, Lennon, Atkins, Hendrix and SRV on how much they've influenced my guitar playing it would go:

Marr
Hendrix
Lennon (but really more for song writing than guitar playing or tone)
Cobain (again, more for song writing than guitar playing)
Atkins
SRV

I don't know if other people agree with this but I kinda seperate out two kinds of guitarist. One is the guitarist who writes guitar to serve the song and the song is the point and the focus. The other other is where the focus is as much on the guitar as the song. Obviously there is a spectrum here from say yer daniel johnston roughly strumming some of the most honest and lovely songs through to what are barely more than a feeble construct of a band that is really a vehicle for its guitarist such as Malmsteen.

Now i apreciate some technical wizardry for its own sake but I prefer listening to well crafted songs. SRV was a great guitarist with a lot of soul compared to many of that ilk BUT I don't think anyone can argue that the songs are half as important as the guitar work - nice little boogies but not of any special importance...they are nice carriers for some fiery guitar awesomness though. I really like Paul Gilbert as a person and admire the fun he has with the guitar and his lack of ego but do i like Mr Big's songs? No because they are appallingly bad and do nothing of any interest!

Umm not sure where this is going - just skip to the end and pretend I was awesome.

http://www.lastfm.pt/music/The+Smiths
http://www.lastfm.pt/music/Sonic+Youth
http://www.lastfm.pt/music/Dinosaur+Jr.

The smiths has more listners and executions that sy and dino jr combine...

This thread is hilarious.
I mean, is'nt there a Biffy Clyro Strat now?
People know i am a big fan of The Smiths but without trying to be bias i can't imagine how some people think Marr is not credible enough to have a sig guitar. Mascis (love him) is less popular and lesser known but no-one questioned his Jazzmaster and it certainly does not go on technical ability otherwise the Jag-Stang would never have been built
Good to see John McGeoch mentioned here too.

To drive home the point of Marr's influence, J Mascis covered The Boy With The Thorn In His Side.

Haw

Justyn wrote:To drive home the point of Marr's influence, J Mascis covered The Boy With The Thorn In His Side.

Haw

Stickin it to the Haters!

I said this in another thread but since this one's specifically about the Jag, I find it odd that's the model he picked. He did much better work with Stratocasters on The Smiths records from what I read. And of course he did awesome work with Rickenbackers and Gibsons. I can recall several instruments he played and that I identify him with way before a Jaguar.

jcyphe wrote:I said this in another thread but since this one's specifically about the Jag, I find it odd that's the model he picked. He did much better work with Stratocasters on The Smiths records from what I read. And of course he did awesome work with Rickenbackers and Gibsons. I can recall several instruments he played and that I identify him with way before a Jaguar.

I agree completely with this, and it's the reason I had a "wtf" moment hearing he had a signature Jag before reading anything else on shortscale regarding the matter. I'm well aware of his influence, just not his influence on the Jaguar.

To get a signature model of a guitar I think you should be well-known for playing it, and perhaps be the catalyst behind a lot of other people buying them. Marr has never been associated with the Jaguar, it's just during his tenure with Modest Mouse (a pre-existing, already-popular band his short-lived collaboration with spawned a few WTFs itself) that he went all Jag-happy.

The notion that Marr would deserve a signature JAGUAR more than J Mascis deserves a signature Jazzmaster is ludicrous for this point alone. Whatever you think of Dinosaur Jr or however more popular/influential you reckon the Smiths are than them, this is about guitars and not bands. A band's popularity doesn't represent their guitarist's popularity in the guitar community. A Jazzmaster was Mascis's first guitar, he does entire shows on one with another two waiting in the wings. People have also been buying Jazzmasters because of the likes of Mascis for almost 2 decades (many of whom post here), if that doesn't qualify you for a sig model I honestly don't know what does. Most people who have a sig Fender have used the model enough to have influenced others buying it. I don't know anyone who's buying a Jaguar to play Johnny Marr's parts on the one or two Modest Mouse records he was on.

An Oliver Ackermann signature Jag would be pretty cool. His are both unique and pretty much all he uses(since starting A Place To Bury Strangers at least), but I guess he's not established enough to get a signature model.

I don't know, who is still making music, uses mostly a Jaguar, and is as well known as Marr? It makes sense to me but perhaps I'm just forgetting someone.

Oh, John Frusciante, but his Jag isn't really unique. Brian Molko, but he's based in the UK and you probably have to be American to get a Fender sig.

Plus the Jag is a good guitar for Smiths sounds, even though he didn't use one. It was probably just the best Fender could do with the limited selection of famous guitarists that use/used Jaguars.